Bladder wants winter WC for 2022

JonM

JonM

New member
All going according to plan.

Around 2019-2020, Qatar will announce that the promised air conditioning system doesn't work and that they have no other choice than to move the tournament to winter. By then, they'll own, sponsor or have the tv rights for many of the top teams anyway so everyone will have to comply.

Also, around 2022-2023, they'll abandon the idea of dismantling the stadia and shipping them to developping countries, citing economic downturn and lack of interest. The world cup will be over so no one will give a shit.
 
Jenks

Jenks

Senior Member
DennyCrane said:
At the moment, gay acts, whatever that means in a legal sense, are a statutory offense with a range of punishment from 90 whiplashes (!) to 5 years in jail in Qatar. Being more 'lax' as you call it, would mean legalizing homosexual acts - under shari'ah law. You surely understand why I doubt that this will happen.
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It won't. They'll just turn a blind eye to it, like with alcohol consumption. The more unnerving reality is going to be that rape will essentially be legal.
 
Raed

Raed

Dr. Raed St. Claire
The WC won't happen in the winter, it just won't. The clubs will destroy this and this is just preliminary engineering,, this is called feasibility studies, and studies of alternative solutions. The FIFA is corrupt to the bone I agree but all yall are ridiculous with nit picking to complain about every single WC. The South Korea and Japan was torn to pieces, the South Africa was labeled the worst world cup ever, now that the WC is in Russia and Qatar again it is being complained about.

And I think having it in countries that can afford the WC is better than placing the burden on poorer cities as they benefit fuck all from it, SA is stuck with stadiums it doesn't want, Detriot just went bankrupt and can't afford to pay its pensioners (even though they are building a 200+ million stadium), riots are happening in Brazil because it is tax payer's money going to the pockets of the corrupt rich, Australia is also warm, innit? Not to mention is it really high on football?

The complaint wasn't that they couldn't cool the stadium the complaint was that they can't cool the city. Which would be ridiculous to do anyway. And even though I have my own reasons to really dislike Qatar and wish the WC is taken away from them, complaints are recycled and happens EVERY SINGLE WORLD CUP.

Playing the WC in Mexico, or USA was pretty hot too, wasn't a big problem then.
 
Raed

Raed

Dr. Raed St. Claire
If we were to accept all complaints we'd end up having the WC in Germany every single year.
 
DennyCrane

DennyCrane

Senior Member
Raed said:
The WC won't happen in the winter, it just won't. The clubs will destroy this and this is just preliminary engineering,, this is called feasibility studies, and studies of alternative solutions. The FIFA is corrupt to the bone I agree but all yall are ridiculous with nit picking to complain about every single WC. The South Korea and Japan was torn to pieces, the South Africa was labeled the worst world cup ever, now that the WC is in Russia and Qatar again it is being complained about.

And I think having it in countries that can afford the WC is better than placing the burden on poorer cities as they benefit fuck all from it, SA is stuck with stadiums it doesn't want, Detriot just went bankrupt and can't afford to pay its pensioners (even though they are building a 200+ million stadium), riots are happening in Brazil because it is tax payer's money going to the pockets of the corrupt rich, Australia is also warm, innit? Not to mention is it really high on football?

The complaint wasn't that they couldn't cool the stadium the complaint was that they can't cool the city. Which would be ridiculous to do anyway. And even though I have my own reasons to really dislike Qatar and wish the WC is taken away from them, complaints are recycled and happens EVERY SINGLE WORLD CUP.

Playing the WC in Mexico, or USA was pretty hot too, wasn't a big problem then.
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As far as I remember, Japan/S. Korea and South Africa WCs weren't criticized because of the climate. Japan/S. Korea WC was mainly criticized afterwards because of the surprisingly low level performances of many teams, more than strange referee decisions especially against Italy and Spain and also because of the lack of impulses for future football development.
The SA worldcup was a different story: 20000 people deported into refugee camps, lowered budgets to finance public housing, slums razed to the ground, construction crew workers on less than minimum wages and the FIFA who didn't gave two shits about any of this. After the party was over, the only ones who cashed in were the FIFA and the construction consortiums. SA on the other hand was left alone with a pile of debt, cities who can't pay the maintenance costs for the stadiums etc. And everyone involved knew that this would happen from the beginning.

With Qatar, it's not only the climate, the human rights violations, the fact that Qatar is a slave-trader state who pays workers (whose passes they took when they entered the country) 70 cent per hour, houses them in buildings as big as a garden shed at 50 degree C without air condition, or the lack of football tradition. It's the blushless apparentness why this decision was made. And the political implications of this decision are willingly and knowingly ignored. You can't call this nit-picking. You just can't.
 
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Raed

Raed

Dr. Raed St. Claire
DennyCrane said:
As far as I remember, Japan/S. Korea and South Africa WCs weren't criticized because of the climate. Japan/S. Korea WC was mainly criticized afterwards because of the surprisingly low level performances of many teams, more than strange referee decisions especially against Italy and Spain and also because of the lack of impulses for future football development.
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Every single World Cup has been criticized beyond any sensible points of discussion and that is just a matter of fact and that is the nature of things. In the end it proved to be a successful tournament, as I expect Qatar to be, as well as Russie and Brazil.

The SA worldcup was a different story: 20000 people deported into refugee camps, lowered budgets to finance public housing, slums razed to the ground, construction crew workers on less than minimum wages and the FIFA who didn't gave two shits about any of this. After the party was over, the only ones who cashed in were the FIFA and the construction consortiums. SA on the other hand was left alone with a pile of debt, cities who can't pay the maintenance costs for the stadiums etc. And everyone involved knew that this would happen from the beginning.
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That is my point exactly, why award the world cup to countries that aren't as financially capable of surviving the costs that the WC incurs on it? Brazil is one of the top 5 economies and the people are complaining about it and construction of stadiums aren't even on schedule. Who'd that leave? Qatar can surely pump gas money into this mega project which has caused a chain reaction of building cities and towns and sports centers which is what the WC is supposed to do. Not go to a country where soccer is popular and have it there, it is meant to grow the sport around the world. Now I am not trying to paint a very rosey picture of an institution like FIFA but the US for instance submitted a proposal that was going to benefit its NFL more than its MLS. Which was retarded. Plus the WC is based on proposals, as with any other bid around the world, you can't give poitns or select based on preference, but based on a review of proposals. Surely the money pumped into the Pan AM games isn't making me too excited here in Canada with the way the country is being run and we have it well here so what'd that leave poorer countries like? Especially seeing what happened to SA.

With Qatar, it's not only the climate, the human rights violations, the fact that Qatar is a slave-trader state who pays workers (whose passes they took when they entered the country) 70 cent per hour, houses them in buildings as big as a garden shed at 50 degree C without air condition, or the lack of football tradition. It's the blushless apparentness why this decision was made. And the political implications of this decision are willingly and knowingly ignored. You can't call this nit-picking. You just can't.
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Wait. Paid workers are slaves? Workers who get issued a work permit and are allowed to leave are slaves? I get your point but there is a heavy insult to actual slavery practiced in the US well into the 1900s because the comparison is ridiculous. I accept it is exploitation of the poor which is based on a contract between these worker's home countries and Qatar. They submit a nice proposal and only very very few others would have been more deserving.
 
Ketoth

Ketoth

New member
I see no reason as to why Qatar shouldn't host the world cup. It is called the world cup for a reason, it needs to reach new boundaries and Qatar does that.
There is no world cup without problems. Honestly I think holding it in Qatar has less problems than holding it in Brazil next year with what has happened.

As for the weather issue, they said they will air condition the stadiums. How do you think Qataris get about? You'd think they'd all be dead from heat exhaustion listening to the complaints!
All buildings and vehicles get air conditioned, no one should stay outside for more than 3 hours really. There's nothing to do outside, everything is indoors. I've been to Dubai in the summer and it's not much different than Qatar. That is how I expect.
 
DennyCrane

DennyCrane

Senior Member
Raed said:
That is my point exactly, why award the world cup to countries that aren't as financially capable of surviving the costs that the WC incurs on it? Brazil is one of the top 5 economies and the people are complaining about it and construction of stadiums aren't even on schedule. Who'd that leave? Qatar can surely pump gas money into this mega project which has caused a chain reaction of building cities and towns and sports centers which is what the WC is supposed to do. Not go to a country where soccer is popular and have it there, it is meant to grow the sport around the world. Now I am not trying to paint a very rosey picture of an institution like FIFA but the US for instance submitted a proposal that was going to benefit its NFL more than its MLS. Which was retarded. Plus the WC is based on proposals, as with any other bid around the world, you can't give poitns or select based on preference, but based on a review of proposals. Surely the money pumped into the Pan AM games isn't making me too excited here in Canada with the way the country is being run and we have it well here so what'd that leave poorer countries like? Especially seeing what happened to SA.
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But did Qatar really need an incentive like the world cup to start a period of growth ? I understand the concept of a WC as a kickstart for economic growth and the philosophy of expansion and as Blatter said himself; thinking this idea through strategically, 2026 should be China or India. The problem I see with this is the discrepance in basic core values between what the FIFA proclaims what it stands for, and what the reality is. Simply put, you can't promote tolerance, respect and human rights as an organization and then give the WC to a country that pisses all over these values. And I'm not simple-hearted enough to truly believe in a world cup working as a cultural franchise, especially when it concerns a wahhabist monarchy who are quite... steadfast concerning their values. I don't believe they'll open up; quite the contrary. This event is exactly what the regime needs to whitewash themselves.

I am aware that the WC is based on proposals; in the beginning, Qatars' proposal was seen with little to no chances of success. Where did this sudden change of mind come from ? According to a committee member of the South American section, Qatar bought votes even before they submitted their application. Two members of the executive comittee, those of Tahiti and Nigeria, offered their votes for sale and were recorded on camera. Then there's Platini who openly denied voting Qatar until his son joined the QSI - then he had to show his true colors. And those are only the documented cases. Seeing this, your 'they had a nice proposal' theory you pointed out below as the main catalyst for the votes' result is untenable. And there were alternatives in Japan, S.Korea, Australia and the US. All of which would have been preferable for various reasons; but only if the vote wasn't about personal enrichment which it obviously is.

Raed said:
Wait. Paid workers are slaves? Workers who get issued a work permit and are allowed to leave are slaves? I get your point but there is a heavy insult to actual slavery practiced in the US well into the 1900s because the comparison is ridiculous. I accept it is exploitation of the poor which is based on a contract between these worker's home countries and Qatar. They submit a nice proposal and only very very few others would have been more deserving.
Click to expand...

This is more a semantic issue. Slavery isn't limited to the US and the US isn't the international benchmark for slavery, neither does slavery start with a complete deprivation of rights or millions of dead people as the result.
The contract between Qatar and the workers home countries doesn't really matter. What we have in Qatar is a case of visa-sponsorship, where the local contractor gets to keep the workers' passes, who mostly come from Nepal and the Philippines. They are not allowed to leave which results in compulsory labor. They work over 12 hours a day in 50 degree C heat, wages are often not paid and even if they are they are as low as it gets. Workers live in dirty overcrowded work-camps.
Statistically, 4 workers die every week building the infrastructure in Qatar. You might find the word inadequate, but this is modern day slavery as far as I'm concerned.
 
Raed

Raed

Dr. Raed St. Claire
DennyCrane said:
But did Qatar really need an incentive like the world cup to start a period of growth ? I understand the concept of a WC as a kickstart for economic growth and the philosophy of expansion and as Blatter said himself; thinking this idea through strategically, 2026 should be China or India. The problem I see with this is the discrepance in basic core values between what the FIFA proclaims what it stands for, and what the reality is. Simply put, you can't promote tolerance, respect and human rights as an organization and then give the WC to a country that pisses all over these values. And I'm not simple-hearted enough to truly believe in a world cup working as a cultural franchise, especially when it concerns a wahhabist monarchy who are quite... steadfast concerning their values. I don't believe they'll open up; quite the contrary. This event is exactly what the regime needs to whitewash themselves.

I am aware that the WC is based on proposals; in the beginning, Qatars' proposal was seen with little to no chances of success. Where did this sudden change of mind come from ? According to a committee member of the South American section, Qatar bought votes even before they submitted their application. Two members of the executive comittee, those of Tahiti and Nigeria, offered their votes for sale and were recorded on camera. Then there's Platini who openly denied voting Qatar until his son joined the QSI - then he had to show his true colors. And those are only the documented cases. Seeing this, your 'they had a nice proposal' theory you pointed out below as the main catalyst for the votes' result is untenable. And there were alternatives in Japan, S.Korea, Australia and the US. All of which would have been preferable for various reasons; but only if the vote wasn't about personal enrichment which it obviously is.



This is more a semantic issue. Slavery isn't limited to the US and the US isn't the international benchmark for slavery, neither does slavery start with a complete deprivation of rights or millions of dead people as the result.
The contract between Qatar and the workers home countries doesn't really matter. What we have in Qatar is a case of visa-sponsorship, where the local contractor gets to keep the workers' passes, who mostly come from Nepal and the Philippines. They are not allowed to leave which results in compulsory labor. They work over 12 hours a day in 50 degree C heat, wages are often not paid and even if they are they are as low as it gets. Workers live in dirty overcrowded work-camps.
Statistically, 4 workers die every week building the infrastructure in Qatar. You might find the word inadequate, but this is modern day slavery as far as I'm concerned.
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I'd love to continue this but I am at work unfortunately, I should get back to you soon.
 
Galning

Galning

Moderator
Am I the only one that finds it funny that he called him Bladder instead of Blatter? I only just noticed it :blush:
 
T

Theconomist

New member
DennyCrane said:
At the moment, gay acts, whatever that means in a legal sense, are a statutory offense with a range of punishment from 90 whiplashes (!) to 5 years in jail in Qatar. Being more 'lax' as you call it, would mean legalizing homosexual acts - under shari'ah law. You surely understand why I doubt that this will happen.

Anyway, where would the incentive to legalize homosexual acts be coming from ? Because sure as hell not from Blatter, who basically told gay couples to not fuck around there.
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I live here and I can tell you that we've got one of the most vibrant gay communities in the arab world.
 
PaulFCB

PaulFCB

Banned
What do gay laws have to do with a World Cup? Is this a gay sport or something?
It's not like gays will come to the World Cup and between halves they will start to fuck around in the stands and in the parks and get sentenced to death for that.
What are they gonna do? Get into their hotel rooms at night and arrest them if they sleep in the same bed or catch them during the act?
In Romania women got imprisoned in the 90's for hitting on other women :lol: :lol: :lol:, you could report if someone the same sex would try to pick you up and gay jokes between friends after a drink wouldn't be seen as funny by old people. Those were unchanged laws of before 1989 and probably backed up by the Church, but the Western laws aren't much better, like getting arrested or being fired for hitting on a woman :facepalm:.
 
UEFA_Barça_Chris

UEFA_Barça_Chris

o Fenômeno
PaulFCB said:
What do gay laws have to do with a World Cup? Is this a gay sport or something?
It's not like gays will come to the World Cup and between halves they will start to fuck around in the stands and in the parks and get sentenced to death for that.
What are they gonna do? Get into their hotel rooms at night and arrest them if they sleep in the same bed or catch them during the act?
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:lol::lol::lol: very detailed.
 
Jenks

Jenks

Senior Member
PaulFCB said:
What do gay laws have to do with a World Cup? Is this a gay sport or something?
It's not like gays will come to the World Cup and between halves they will start to fuck around in the stands and in the parks and get sentenced to death for that.
What are they gonna do? Get into their hotel rooms at night and arrest them if they sleep in the same bed or catch them during the act?
Click to expand...

What about kissing or other displays of affection in public? I know what the laws are but I've no idea how the police or the locals will really react. The worrying issue, as I've said - is rape. In countries like Qatar the law will always try and find a way to blame the victim.
 
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